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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
I am sorry to say but the engine is going to remain the same and things are not going to change dramatically after the first service. This is a hard revving engine and if you want to remain in 3rd gear while doing 50kmph, then you'll be revving the engine past 4-5k rpm and that is when you will feel that the engine is getting strained, which in reality it is not cuz it does come alive at that rpm. But I know what you mean so I would say that you just need to get used to this engine characteristics. From my experience, you will be able to do 30kmph in 3rd gear at roughly 3k rpm and that is when you will feel that the engine is relaxed. Go beyond 3k rpm and you will feel that the engine is stressed. Again, perhaps you feel like that cuz you're used to riding a more relaxed engine.
so basically, I am allowed to go 6-7k rpm easily.... it's just thst I'm feeling engine strain because of comparatively lower torque than the bikes im comparing it with (cb 350 and RE)

Thanks for answering btw, i really got perspective
 

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Discussion Starter · #22 ·
Hi,
As a rider for over 20 years, I think that you already have 2 very good replies:





But maybe I can still contribute something, since you state that you are a new rider, and there is a bit more to the total picture.
1) Running in
You should run the bike in, as specified in the manual.
This will extend the life of the motor, but will have little effect on it's overall feel. ( I actually did 1,000 miles, not just the specified 750 )
2) This bike is a single cylinder.
This format is inherently unbalanced, since there is only the weight of a single piston being thrown up and down inside the motor- up, stop, down, stop, back up.
Even with balancing weights on the crank to counteract the forces created, it will never be as smooth as an inline twin cylinder, or triple, or the most balanced of all inlines, a
four. In these formats the pistons are timed to rotate in an order to help smooth out vibration by counteracting the weight of one piston with the weight of another.
Other options, like BMW's famous 'Boxer' twin engine have 2 'opposing' cylinders. One cylinder comes out of one side of the engine, and the other on the other side.
The weight of one piston is counteracted by the opposing piston on the other side- Inherently smoother than all the above.
3) High revving engines
As the quote above, with modern lubricants and technology, engines are designed to rev high. It's not a problem !
So, I really think the concept of 'strain' at only halfway through the rev. band is misleading.
The bike is NOT 'straining', it is vibrating ( sure ), and getting nearer to the higher level of power output ( 'coming on cam' ),
That's not doing the bike any harm at all. In fact, it's exhibiting both the designed performance ( more power at higher rev.s ) and the limitations of the motor's format. ( single
cylinder at faster revolutions = more vibration )
I grew up riding 2 stroke 'screamers', which were all about maximum BHP in very narrow power bands at the very top of the rev. range.
That simply meant high rev.s or zero power. Check out reviews of the Kawasaki Mach III H1 from the 70's for the most extreme illustration: 2 choices- power off, power on !
The red line is your guide for the limits of the engine, and as a fail-safe, there is an automatic rev. limiter which just cuts the engine if you go over it.
But that says nothing about your comfort !
If you don't like the feel of the high rev.s, you'll learn how to avoid them.
4) Gears
Gears are primarily designed to maximise the power of the engine to obtain the highest speed possible.
Anyone using a pedal bike knows that to try to start off in top gear is near impossible.
Likewise, you cannot possibly pedal fast enough in a low gear to get to the same speed you can in top gear.
Now, transpose this to the motorcycle, thinking of what you asking your motor to do in each gear.
Now, question: Why do you want to 'cruise' in a low gear ? What are you trying to achieve ?
It seems to be a bit like looking through the wrong end of a telescope. You can do it, sure. But, why would you ?..
If you want the bike to feel 'lazy', choose a higher gear. Less rev.s, less vibration, but less power/slower reactions to the throttle.
Lower gear at the same speed means more rev.s, and it'll feel 'busy' !

I hope some of the above helps.
THANKS A LOTTT!!!!

actually why i want to cruise in lower gear is that, i thought that it was requiring really constant up shifts馃槄 i mean i would like for it to atleast be able to do 40-45kmph in 3rd gear without revs rising beyond 5k ( where the engine really "turns on")
because I live in a busy kind of city, India to be specific, here single cylinder is the norm! even this 300c is considered power horse here
so that's why i had the perception that atleast i could go maybe higher kmph in same gears without revving it too much to almost sound like a showoff on road and also feel that engine "vibe" you mentioned around 5-6k rpm.

Today after reading this forum's comments I did try revving it hard. i took it to 7-8k. loved it. but then again it was very unsafe because of the city I live in. so that's why I asked if I could just get lower rpms at 3-4th gear? i think now I'm asking right questions. i researched that cruiser bike like royal Enfield, they generate their max torque at as low as 3.5k rpm. that's why 3rd or 4th gear in those bikes can take you to even 80kmph without engine feeling strained(because rpm is so low! i understand that mechanic now after i tried riding it to higher revs today!)

will bike be smoother at lower gears and maybe be driven longer at 3-4th gear after its first breakin service? can i ask my official service guy if he can maybe tune down the throttle /power for better torque delivery? i dont really prefer instant throttling to get better speeds. (sure its immensely fun but then again, im constantly afraid some dog might cross my path and I'll lose control)
sorry again if I'm asking stupid questions or sounding like a noob. thanks again for your long answer
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
Hi,
As a rider for over 20 years, I think that you already have 2 very good replies:





But maybe I can still contribute something, since you state that you are a new rider, and there is a bit more to the total picture.
1) Running in
You should run the bike in, as specified in the manual.
This will extend the life of the motor, but will have little effect on it's overall feel. ( I actually did 1,000 miles, not just the specified 750 )
2) This bike is a single cylinder.
This format is inherently unbalanced, since there is only the weight of a single piston being thrown up and down inside the motor- up, stop, down, stop, back up.
Even with balancing weights on the crank to counteract the forces created, it will never be as smooth as an inline twin cylinder, or triple, or the most balanced of all inlines, a
four. In these formats the pistons are timed to rotate in an order to help smooth out vibration by counteracting the weight of one piston with the weight of another.
Other options, like BMW's famous 'Boxer' twin engine have 2 'opposing' cylinders. One cylinder comes out of one side of the engine, and the other on the other side.
The weight of one piston is counteracted by the opposing piston on the other side- Inherently smoother than all the above.
3) High revving engines
As the quote above, with modern lubricants and technology, engines are designed to rev high. It's not a problem !
So, I really think the concept of 'strain' at only halfway through the rev. band is misleading.
The bike is NOT 'straining', it is vibrating ( sure ), and getting nearer to the higher level of power output ( 'coming on cam' ),
That's not doing the bike any harm at all. In fact, it's exhibiting both the designed performance ( more power at higher rev.s ) and the limitations of the motor's format. ( single
cylinder at faster revolutions = more vibration )
I grew up riding 2 stroke 'screamers', which were all about maximum BHP in very narrow power bands at the very top of the rev. range.
That simply meant high rev.s or zero power. Check out reviews of the Kawasaki Mach III H1 from the 70's for the most extreme illustration: 2 choices- power off, power on !
The red line is your guide for the limits of the engine, and as a fail-safe, there is an automatic rev. limiter which just cuts the engine if you go over it.
But that says nothing about your comfort !
If you don't like the feel of the high rev.s, you'll learn how to avoid them.
4) Gears
Gears are primarily designed to maximise the power of the engine to obtain the highest speed possible.
Anyone using a pedal bike knows that to try to start off in top gear is near impossible.
Likewise, you cannot possibly pedal fast enough in a low gear to get to the same speed you can in top gear.
Now, transpose this to the motorcycle, thinking of what you asking your motor to do in each gear.
Now, question: Why do you want to 'cruise' in a low gear ? What are you trying to achieve ?
It seems to be a bit like looking through the wrong end of a telescope. You can do it, sure. But, why would you ?..
If you want the bike to feel 'lazy', choose a higher gear. Less rev.s, less vibration, but less power/slower reactions to the throttle.
Lower gear at the same speed means more rev.s, and it'll feel 'busy' !

I hope some of the above helps.
another question, is it fine to replace sprocket to get better torque but lower top speed /lower acceleration? im fine with this trade off! will that void my warranty? will the official service guys be happy to do it?
 

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From your preceding posts, a sprocket change is probably what you are looking for.
Also, our bikes are reputed as having short lower gears and long higher gears. This means that you can expect to change the first three gears pretty rapidly.
Earlier in the thread, Hasselman suggested a 15 tooth front sprocket. There are numerous threads on this subject on the forum (either removing on adding a tooth to the front sprocket)
As far as I know this should not affect warranty.
As for the "official service guys" only they can answer your question, but an independent mechanic can do it easily, and most DIY people can also do it without breaking a sweat.
 

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Discussion Starter · #25 ·
From your preceding posts, a sprocket change is probably what you are looking for.
Also, our bikes are reputed as having short lower gears and long higher gears. This means that you can expect to change the first three gears pretty rapidly.
Earlier in the thread, Hasselman suggested a 15 tooth front sprocket. There are numerous threads on this subject on the forum (either removing on adding a tooth to the front sprocket)
As far as I know this should not affect warranty.
As for the "official service guys" only they can answer your question, but an independent mechanic can do it easily, and most DIY people can also do it without breaking a sweat.
That's exactly what I am looking for!

but will first service have any significant affect at low gear performances?
 

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another question, is it fine to replace sprocket to get better torque but lower top speed /lower acceleration? im fine with this trade off! will that void my warranty? will the official service guys be happy to do it?
Fewer teeth on the front sprocket will increase power ( rev.s ) per rear wheel revolution/distance traveled = faster acceleration with reduced top speed ( normally ).
More teeth on the front sprocket reduces power per foot traveled, but the engine may not have the BHP to pull a higher top speed.
You can get a more refined/gradual change by changing the rear sprocket and using the opposite ratio, but it'll cost more for the parts.

As for warrantee, that's down to the dealership.
It's not like adding a sticker. It is affecting the 'engineering' of the bike, so some might use it a reason to void the warrantee.
Probably best to ask them before you do it....
 

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THANKS A LOTTT!!!!

actually why i want to cruise in lower gear is that, i thought that it was requiring really constant up shifts馃槄 i mean i would like for it to atleast be able to do 40-45kmph in 3rd gear without revs rising beyond 5k ( where the engine really "turns on")
because I live in a busy kind of city, India to be specific, here single cylinder is the norm! even this 300c is considered power horse here
so that's why i had the perception that atleast i could go maybe higher kmph in same gears without revving it too much to almost sound like a showoff on road and also feel that engine "vibe" you mentioned around 5-6k rpm.

Today after reading this forum's comments I did try revving it hard. i took it to 7-8k. loved it. but then again it was very unsafe because of the city I live in. so that's why I asked if I could just get lower rpms at 3-4th gear? i think now I'm asking right questions. i researched that cruiser bike like royal Enfield, they generate their max torque at as low as 3.5k rpm. that's why 3rd or 4th gear in those bikes can take you to even 80kmph without engine feeling strained(because rpm is so low! i understand that mechanic now after i tried riding it to higher revs today!)

will bike be smoother at lower gears and maybe be driven longer at 3-4th gear after its first breakin service? can i ask my official service guy if he can maybe tune down the throttle /power for better torque delivery? i dont really prefer instant throttling to get better speeds. (sure its immensely fun but then again, im constantly afraid some dog might cross my path and I'll lose control)
sorry again if I'm asking stupid questions or sounding like a noob. thanks again for your long answer
I know what it's like in Indian cities, so I understand your concern.
Raising the gearing will 'soften' the acceleration and reduce vibration ( by lowering rev.s per rear wheel revolution ), so it may be the answer you are looking for.
But, I think you are at risk of over-thinking the whole deal, when you haven't even got used to the bike or riding yet.
It's only my taste, but I liked to be 'swapping cogs'.
I suggest that you give it at least 2,000 miles before your start messing about with it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #28 ·
I know what it's like in Indian cities, so I understand your concern.
Raising the gearing will 'soften' the acceleration and reduce vibration ( by lowering rev.s per rear wheel revolution ), so it may be the answer you are looking for.
But, I think you are at risk of over-thinking the whole deal, when you haven't even got used to the bike or riding yet.
It's only my taste, but I liked to be 'swapping cogs'.
I suggest that you give it at least 2,000 miles before your start messing about with it.
really?!? constant gear shifting gets fun?
 

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so basically, I am allowed to go 6-7k rpm easily.... it's just thst I'm feeling engine strain because of comparatively lower torque than the bikes im comparing it with (cb 350 and RE)

Thanks for answering btw, i really got perspective
Check out RE Thunderbird's RPM meter, it starts red-lining at 6k rpm and check out the 310's RPM meter, it lights up the snowflake at 10.5k. I think you will be able to translate the rest.
 

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One question though: why are you against changing gears? Come on man, you're riding a motorcycle and not a scooter! It's fun to change gears up and down (with rev matching). It is a part of the motorcycling experience.
 

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really?!? constant gear shifting gets fun?
The opportunity to run through the entire gear box several times between my house and the grocery store is often the reason I roll the 310R out of the garage instead of taking the 750 or the Ford truck.

Zoom zoom.

... will first service have any significant affect ...
It's not the service itself. Basically an oil change and some checks to ensure the particular bike/engine isn't showing any QAQC or tolerance issues. I was 17 years old when I was assigned 80% of the running in checks working at a dealership. Nothing magical happens in that shop bay.

It's those first few thousand miles of "good wear" that the engine and transmission (rings, gears, sprockets, all metal to metal moving parts) settle in and smooth out, gradually. It won't be one "aha!" moment. It'll be looking back and realizing the bike feels better. And part of that improvement is due to your own adjustment and learning what this bike likes.

I was coming back down from larger bikes when I got the 310. I can clearly remember thinking this bike would explode above 65Mph as I first rode it. Odo shows 6500+ miles on my 310R and now I'm easing off from 85-90Mph when I see police cars in the distance.

My commute is an hour+ each way, and the 310R lives at 8000-8500 most of that.
 

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It has been very helpful to me adjusting to the 310 that I have years of cruising small sailboats with outboard engines.

When you have 50+ miles to your next anchorage, and zero wind, you crank that little 6hp single cylinder outboard. I set throttle at 80% and lock it, many folks go WOT and lock it. Then set the waypoints on the autohelm, and head below decks to make coffee and choose a book to read. It is very frequent that I run the little outboard engines like this 16 hours straight. And they last many years performing this way.
 

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Discussion Starter · #34 ·
The opportunity to run through the entire gear box several times between my house and the grocery store is often the reason I roll the 310R out of the garage instead of taking the 750 or the Ford truck.

Zoom zoom.



It's not the service itself. Basically an oil change and some checks to ensure the particular bike/engine isn't showing any QAQC or tolerance issues. I was 17 years old when I was assigned 80% of the running in checks working at a dealership. Nothing magical happens in that shop bay.

It's those first few thousand miles of "good wear" that the engine and transmission (rings, gears, sprockets, all metal to metal moving parts) settle in and smooth out, gradually. It won't be one "aha!" moment. It'll be looking back and realizing the bike feels better. And part of that improvement is due to your own adjustment and learning what this bike likes.

I was coming back down from larger bikes when I got the 310. I can clearly remember thinking this bike would explode above 65Mph as I first rode it. Odo sho6500+ miles on my 310R and now I'm easing off from 85-90Mph when I see police cars in the distance.

My commute is an hour+ each way, and the 310R lives at 8000-8500 most of that.
wow!
It has been very helpful to me adjusting to the 310 that I have years of cruising small sailboats with outboard engines.

When you have 50+ miles to your next anchorage, and zero wind, you crank that little 6hp single cylinder outboard. I set throttle at 80% and lock it, many folks go WOT and lock it. Then set the waypoints on the autohelm, and head below decks to make coffee and choose a book to read. It is very frequent that I run the little outboard engines like this 16 hours straight. And they last many years performing this way.
Hey kent, today I rode like you suggested yesterday. I FINGG LOVED IT. its veryyy good bike. its ease rpm range is either below 4k or above 5-6k. i was driving in between. that's wrong. and constantly gear shifting is amazinggggggg i revved in 4th gear till 65kmph then I upshifted to 6th to cruise slightly and maintain speed cus it was a city area.


is up shifting twice or downshifting twice aggressively good riding habit?
 

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is up shifting twice or downshifting twice aggressively good riding habit?
Let's separate shifting "often" from shifting "aggressively." Actual racing bikes, track or drag strip, have frequent engine and transmission tear downs and rebuilds for a reason.

I aim for smooth shifts.

I aim for long mechanical life.

One gear at a time, each doing the job of its range. What range exactly? That's on you, and you'll develop your own feel and riding style.

I'm not ever moving the shifter two positions in the same clutch pull, unless I've made a preceding mistake I'm having to correct.

A lot of this becomes feel. Best teacher in the world is riding time. Ride daily and you'll come to know the bike, and yourself, extremely well.

Rule #1 for safe riding is to always ride at your comfort level. Never let the guy who just passed you, or some guy on an internet forum, dictate your ride. My mentions of 90mph or 8500rpm are related to what's safe for this engine.

More important is riding safely for your body. 馃槈
 

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Lots of good responses here, but the bottom line is the bike is engineered to use the whole rpm range it's rated for...use all, or at least most, of that rpm range before bothering to shift. If you own or previously owned bikes with larger engines, you have to re-train yourself and give yourself "permission" to go high on RPMs (and smile as you do!).
 

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Lots of good responses here, but the bottom line is the bike is engineered to use the whole rpm range it's rated for...use all, or at least most, of that rpm range before bothering to shift. If you own or previously owned bikes with larger engines, you have to re-train yourself and give yourself "permission" to go high on RPMs (and smile as you do!).
I am re-training myself every time I get on the bike. Cheers!
 
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